How good are your part estimates?

They must keep waiting until they get the best answer for it. If not, they must ready to facing the risk of it.
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To knowing the qualities, we have to do some test on it. That's the best way to know the qualities of it.
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Machine Burden Rate Calculations

In response to the question about a thumb rule for machine rate calculations, anyone wanting a free machine burden rate calculator for their own use can ask for one by sending an email to Machines@JDLTech.ca
No gimmicks, just a free tool to use.
Too often we see companies trying to use blended rates for all their machines or don't calculate these costs properly at all by not including all of the fixed or variable costs. Folks, please take advantage of this free tool.
Knowing your machine costs will get you much closer to getting accurate part estimates.

hi,
is there any thum rule for machine hour rate calculation

Freight is billed through determine size of packaging. In other case, billing charge can be implement through product weight.

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I do not own any molds. My customers pay 100% for them and I store and maintain them. (Okay, I clean them and lube them everyday before starting) Customer pays for any worn out parts etc. I also charge a fixed price to install/remove a mold. It is rolled up into the price the customer pays per part. Rarely, does it seem, that my sprue sets the cooling pace.
Mold change overs do seem to take a long time especially if I'm doing them and taking phone calls as well. (I'm trying to do less wrench turning and more sales/boss stuff)

I was referring to how a Molder calculates (if he/she does)the effects of a cold runner/sprue on overall cycle time?

Keep on Molding!

brent

www.matrixtooling.com

Raynjer, Brent

Good answers! Anybody else?

What happens when you miss your bid? When you hope to get (for example) $40/hr for the machine, forgetting what Raynjer and Brent talk about will lower your salable machine rate to $25-30. And, this is before the dreaded phone call from the buyer who wants an additional 10% reduction 'Just Because'.

OK fellow readers, posters and Lurkers. What are your opinions?

Bill, being able to quote within 3-5% should be the target everyone needs to be working to in order to stay competitive these days. The trick is actually being able to do that.

To attain this, the quotes must be able to accurately take into account many extra things that typically don’t get included by most estimators. There is more to the cost than # of parts, cycle time and cost of material. What is often left out of the cost are such things as maintenance required on the molds, setup time for each lot run, scrap rates, runners and sprues as Brent points out, regrind, quality checks, amortization of the mold cost, packaging, any special costs, logisitcs, plus other items. It is surprising how many companies we talk with when we pitch our estimating software, who don’t put any consideration into any of this.
Even the most obvious areas to consider need to be calculated properly which may not be so easy, especially when you don’t have part data or you are quoting a part where you have no similar previous experience. It’s going to be pretty tricky to come up with a reliable cycle time that will enable a proper quote. Having software that helps you to estimate cycle times and come up with reliable quotes whether you are working to data, detailed sketches or napkin sketches is imperative to coming up with realistic quotes.
Then after that it all depends on guys like Brent, Joeprocess and others to ensure they are running the jobs at optimum cycle times to keep the estimator looking good!
Going back to Bill’s initial question though, from the feedback of some of our customers, they can generally consistently get in the 3% range compared to actual costs when working with data.

As for Brent’s question about runners, a runner size is automatically calculated depending on the runner profile selected when doing a mold calculation and in the part calculation this sizing is used to calculate the weight of the runner system. Then we also look at the percentage of regrind allowed if any and any share of material costs for recycled material.

Raynjer

Going along with this, how do you and other Molders) consider the runner/sprue when estimating cycles? The estimating programs and Rule of Thumb, I see don't seem to take the cold runner into account.

Keep on Molding!

brent

I got to thinking about my post. Let me Clarify:

Let's assume a part is quoted at a 20 second cycle. A 5% error would be the cycle came in no less than 19 seconds and no more than 21 seconds. A 10% error on a 20 second cycle is plus or minus 2 seconds.

When I talk cycle time, I don't mean clamp to clamp. Think of cycle time in net (salable) pieces per hour.

Now I can restate my original post. For the past year(?) or however long you can remember can you come up with the percentage (as above) with how your estimates compared with the real world.

Bill

Bill
I usually can get pretty close. These days with solid models, I don't have to try to figure the weights so that works right on. The cooling time usually depends on wall thickness so I try to sandbag a bit to allow me to make a few dollars per hour more. Then I throw in install and removal cost for the set up. That also works well.
I do have two problems though. Parts we run where we have to clip off the gates or even break off the gates. Somehow, I really under estimate that part. My other problem is estimating TPE material. If for cooling time I put in "forever" the parts become infinitely expensive. ie just finished running a 2 cavity part and I had to cool it for 50 seconds! I'm scared to look back to see what I originally figured even though I take normal cooling time and double it.
Yes, I know to have a short sprue and much greater taper 3 degrees per side?